Website Home | Info & Posts | Club Membership | Eagle History | Contact Us

OVER THE PAST YEAR OR SO, WE HAVE BEEN WORKING TO MAKE SIGNIFICANT UPGRADES TO THIS FORUM

The progress has been slow, but we continue to work on the project

BOTH THE WEBSITE AND THE FORUM ARE FULLY FUNCTIONAL AND AVAILABLE FOR OUR MEMBER'S/READER'S ENJOYMENT

For update activity/status click on this thread.

Mason's 1968 model 05

This is a public forum. This forum will be a place to show your Project Eagle and updates on progress you have made. Please make one thread with your project and put all updates in the same thread. Sorry... Eagles only.
Re: Mason's 1968 model 05
Sun Mar 08, 2020 12:04 pm


Yes, and it was your royal opportunity to check the play in the Bull Gear bearing while you were there.
Walter
Dayton, Ohio
1975 Silvereagle Model 05, 8V71, 4 speed Spicer
1982 Eagle Model 10, 6V92, 5 speed Spicer
1984 Eagle Model 10, 6V92 w/Jacobs, Allison HT740
1994 Eagle Model 15-45, Series 60 w/Jacobs, Allison HT746
User avatar
DoubleEagle
Club Member
Club Member
 
Posts: 179
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:26 pm
Location: Dayton, Ohio


Re: Mason's 1968 model 05
Sun Mar 08, 2020 12:17 pm


Ok Walter, you opened up Pandora's box. :D :o

I live in fear of a bull gear failure. I have all the documentation on my engine rebuild from the truck the engine came out of. It was a very thorough rebuild by a Detroit dealer, but no mention of replacing/rebuilding the bull gear.

Each year I pull one of the covers and pry on the gear to test the bearings, but I am not sure that that is the best test.

How do you test the gear?

Jim
Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
'85 Eagle 10 with Series 60 & Eaton AutoShift 10 speed transmission - not at all fancy, but fully functional
Bus Project pages: http://beltguy.com/Bus_Project/busproject.htm
Blog: http://beltguy.com/blog/
Email: jim@eaglesinternational.net Note: Email sent to the this address requesting technical advice will not receive a response
User avatar
beltguy
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 2327
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2008 4:39 am
Location: Evergreen, CO


Re: Mason's 1968 model 05
Sun Mar 08, 2020 12:31 pm


On a different subject, Mason, I see that you have not yet fabricated the cooling fan drive. I assume you will go with a belt drive.

You will want to design the belt drive with a spring loaded idler in the lower (slack side) of the drive. A couple of folks who have tried to run a two sheave (no spring loaded idler) have had issues.

Wayne and I just got done starting his engine with the new drive configuration and it works wonderfully. I have had mine since the beginning and no problems.

There are two main reasons you should have the spring loaded idler. First, there is movement between the engine and the frame mounted fan drive components. Secondly, the HP load of the fan is the cube of the speed. You do not want to have to tension the belt for the highest load. A spring loaded idler provides tension proportional to the laod (long technical discussion - just go with it :D )

I don't think I ever created a thread on the subject, but I will try to do that in the near future.

Jim
Jim Shepherd
Evergreen, CO
'85 Eagle 10 with Series 60 & Eaton AutoShift 10 speed transmission - not at all fancy, but fully functional
Bus Project pages: http://beltguy.com/Bus_Project/busproject.htm
Blog: http://beltguy.com/blog/
Email: jim@eaglesinternational.net Note: Email sent to the this address requesting technical advice will not receive a response
User avatar
beltguy
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 2327
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2008 4:39 am
Location: Evergreen, CO


Re: Mason's 1968 model 05
Sun Mar 08, 2020 1:21 pm


beltguy wrote:Ok Walter, you opened up Pandora's box. :D :o

I live in fear of a bull gear failure. I have all the documentation on my engine rebuild from the truck the engine came out of. It was a very thorough rebuild by a Detroit dealer, but no mention of replacing/rebuilding the bull gear.

Each year I pull one of the covers and pry on the gear to test the bearings, but I am not sure that that is the best test.

How do you test the gear?

Jim



Once I talked to a Detroit diesel mechanic, he told me to pry on the gear and see if it had any play, sounds good to me.

When I took it off, we weren't sure if it was the bull gear or not, I pried on it with a wrench?! Seemed solid
1968 05 Eagle 8v71 with roadranger 9 speed,
04/25/19 starting upgrade to series 60! and B500
Eagle obsessed
 
Posts: 198
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:37 am
Location: McCook NE


Re: Mason's 1968 model 05
Sun Mar 08, 2020 1:24 pm


beltguy wrote:On a different subject, Mason, I see that you have not yet fabricated the cooling fan drive. I assume you will go with a belt drive.

You will want to design the belt drive with a spring loaded idler in the lower (slack side) of the drive. A couple of folks who have tried to run a two sheave (no spring loaded idler) have had issues.

Wayne and I just got done starting his engine with the new drive configuration and it works wonderfully. I have had mine since the beginning and no problems.

There are two main reasons you should have the spring loaded idler. First, there is movement between the engine and the frame mounted fan drive components. Secondly, the HP load of the fan is the cube of the speed. You do not want to have to tension the belt for the highest load. A spring loaded idler provides tension proportional to the laod (long technical discussion - just go with it :D )

I don't think I ever created a thread on the subject, but I will try to do that in the near future.

Jim


Fan drive.

My miter box is at the fan, and will have a short drive line to it

Have not done to much research on belt tension yet, still waiting on drive shaft

Currently working on electrical grimalins...
1968 05 Eagle 8v71 with roadranger 9 speed,
04/25/19 starting upgrade to series 60! and B500
Eagle obsessed
 
Posts: 198
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:37 am
Location: McCook NE


Re: Mason's 1968 model 05
Sun Mar 08, 2020 5:31 pm


20200226_131321.jpg

this is my newest set up
wayne
User avatar
rusty
Board Member
Board Member
 
Posts: 1456
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 3:22 pm
Location: Johnstown Co.


Re: Mason's 1968 model 05
Sun Mar 08, 2020 6:17 pm


Jim, and Mason, the bull gear bearing is probably the greatest fear inducing situation with the Series 60. The tolerated play I have been told to go on is .006 - .012, which translates to a "flex" feel when you grab it with your fingers, but if it "wiggles" noticeably, it's time for new bearings before the bull gear chips a tooth or two and destroys other gears, the cover, the block. :o The bearings cost a hundred and something, plus labor, if the bull gear goes and takes everything out - thousands upon thousands. But, another factor to consider is the crankshaft damper that should be replaced by 500,000 miles as a matter of maintenance. The vibrations that it helps soften have an effect on the life of the bull gear bearings, which have an average life of 800,000 miles. Some go at 600,000 miles, some go a million plus miles, probably a factor is whether the damper was replaced on schedule, which costs about $400 for the part. Sounds like you both have good bearings for the bull gear, but what about the damper? You can't tell anything by looking at it, unfortunately.

Mason, I have noticed that some Series 60 fan drives have the miter box out by the bumper instead of near the fan (like on Prevost's), which would make it easier to be serviced. My Model 15 has it by the fan, and the oil needs to be drained and replaced on a regular basis (2500 hrs., per Morse Miter Gear, 1 qt. 80W-90).
Walter
Dayton, Ohio
1975 Silvereagle Model 05, 8V71, 4 speed Spicer
1982 Eagle Model 10, 6V92, 5 speed Spicer
1984 Eagle Model 10, 6V92 w/Jacobs, Allison HT740
1994 Eagle Model 15-45, Series 60 w/Jacobs, Allison HT746
User avatar
DoubleEagle
Club Member
Club Member
 
Posts: 179
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:26 pm
Location: Dayton, Ohio


Re: Mason's 1968 model 05
Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:08 pm


DoubleEagle wrote:Mason, I have noticed that some Series 60 fan drives have the miter box out by the bumper instead of near the fan (like on Prevost's), which would make it easier to be serviced. My Model 15 has it by the fan, and the oil needs to be drained and replaced on a regular basis (2500 hrs., per Morse Miter Gear, 1 qt. 80W-90).


Yes, that is true, it is kind of late for me now, there are pros and cons either way. We decided to put the miter box on the fan, although it is harder to change the oil.
but every 2500 hours would be roughly 120,000 miles, counting 20% idle time, so we can just put that on the yearly maintenance list for the most part. Crawling up in there once a year is ok with me. ;)
1968 05 Eagle 8v71 with roadranger 9 speed,
04/25/19 starting upgrade to series 60! and B500
Eagle obsessed
 
Posts: 198
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:37 am
Location: McCook NE


Re: Mason's 1968 model 05
Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:23 pm


DoubleEagle wrote:Looks like you are deep into a complete redo, I envy your work space, I am much more cramped. Your raising the roof technique looks very solid, not every one goes to such lengths to reinforce the posts. Good luck on the rest of it. :D


Walter, just saw this post on the first page of my thread, lol we did not know what was going to happen! :D WWAI!
1968 05 Eagle 8v71 with roadranger 9 speed,
04/25/19 starting upgrade to series 60! and B500
Eagle obsessed
 
Posts: 198
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:37 am
Location: McCook NE


Re: Mason's 1968 model 05
Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:28 pm


So yesterday we verified we had power to computer, shift pad was lit up, everything had power, however the computer was still not quite happy. I am trying to find all the interlocks in the system, starting with verifying the transmission was in neutral.

does the s60 have standard interlocks so it won't start or does it vary with manufacturer?
1968 05 Eagle 8v71 with roadranger 9 speed,
04/25/19 starting upgrade to series 60! and B500
Eagle obsessed
 
Posts: 198
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:37 am
Location: McCook NE


PreviousNext

Return to Project Eagles

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests