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Model 10 Window

This is a public forum to discuss Eagle related technical issues. If you are having a problem with your Eagle, this is the place to find help.
Re: Model 10 Window
Mon Dec 16, 2019 2:08 am


Yes, Walter, the double bag set-up designed by Perley on my drive axle is working great. I seriously can not tell any difference. I only have the set up on the drivers side rear wheel yet , so I can’t testify to the ride in one that has them on both sides. I will say though, that I won’t hesitate to put it on the other side if and when I need it. I don’t have a design for the front, so if one of those fails, I’ll be figuring that one out. You can contact Perley J Benson through Gacebook....,just type his name into the search engine. He’ll get back to you. He’s very proud of his system, as well he should be. It’s the most simplistic design I’ve seen, and though it is a bit of a chore.......not a major one, and I could see how one person could conceivably do it. I wouldn’t, but you could. I know there are a few who want to sell you a new Torsilastic, and I respect that, and emphasize with the rationale........but for me, bagging it was the only sensible choice. Parts were purchased at NAPA, and steel was purchased at the ALRO STEEL public outlet. Plates are already cut, but you’ll need a good metal saw too.
Jim Cummings
1983 Model 10
8V71
Auto Trans
Tour Bus Conversion Ex-Senator Coach
http://www.thejimcummingsband.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
jcb
 
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:37 am


Re: Model 10 Window
Mon Dec 16, 2019 2:11 am


Walter and Jim,

Here is the video Scott Crosby posted of my install. It’s not as complete as I would have expected, but gives a good idea of the process. I’m happy to help should you ever need it on your bus.
https://youtu.be/CVjCTw8RSvk
Jim Cummings
1983 Model 10
8V71
Auto Trans
Tour Bus Conversion Ex-Senator Coach
http://www.thejimcummingsband.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
jcb
 
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:37 am


Re: Model 10 Window
Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:39 am


Jim, thanks for posting the video, it explains the highlights well enough. My main concern with this type of setup is the welding of the square tube to the Torsilastic. I don't see how you avoided doing damage to the rubber compounds inside. If I were to do this arrangement I think I would fashion a round bracket that could be bolted together around the tube of the Torsilastic. Perhaps there was no reason to worry about the condition of the rubber because the Torsilastic was completely shot? Another concern is whether it would be rebuildable as a Torsilastic in the future, if it was sent to Sulastic in Texas, or the outfit in Mexico? Have the welds held up well so far?
Walter
Dayton, Ohio
1975 Silvereagle Model 05, 8V71, 4 speed Spicer
1982 Eagle Model 10, 6V92, 5 speed Spicer
1984 Eagle Model 10, 6V92 w/Jacobs, Allison HT740
1994 Eagle Model 15-45, Series 60 w/Jacobs, Allison HT741
User avatar
DoubleEagle
Club Member
Club Member
 
Posts: 152
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:26 pm
Location: Dayton, Ohio


Re: Model 10 Window
Tue Dec 17, 2019 9:00 am


HiWalter,
First.....sorry I don't see your posts here immediately......always running to keep up at my business.
Anyway, let's address your points.
1- Yes, I know the video is not a complete one, but Scott seemed to be interested in just highlighting it. As it was two miserable 95 degree days in the middle of the hottest time of year, I can't blame him. Took me a few days to recover, glad to get it done, but it was a .....well you know.
2- Yes, it was a concern to avoid either damaging or starting a fire internally in the Torsilastic. Perley had mentioned it in passing, and while we were welding, I realized that melting rubber likely was not a good thing. So, we did it in spaces, and gave it plenty of time to cool in between welds. But, a couple of points here....first, after 2 years of adjusting, fretting, and getting madder by the day.......I'd had enough of fooling with it. Things go bad. That's the way it is. So I didn't much care what I did to the aged out, totally shot Torso. i suppose I could tear it out, send it to Mexico, have to re-mortgage my house, and probably have a nervous breakdown during the process....but I bagged it, and I'm totally happy I did. I'll never have to screw with it again. AND, I absolutely cannot tell the least bit of difference in the ride.
3- The welds are holding up fine, though I plan on checking everything in the spring just in case. It's important to Rustolium the whole thing up asap, so that it doesn't start rusting under there.
4- I like your idea of formulating a bracket, and there is a post here on the forum that shows a CAD drawing of one that a fellow designed, but never built. Check it out. It's well done. It looks like there are a number of people who have designed and built different ways of installing bags on these Eagles. Everyone has a different opinion. But, saying that....my reasoning was/is twofold. First, Perley's design was the simplest, and most cost effective design for my purposes. Second, I neither have the help or ability to be tearing out half or all of the rear end of this Model 10 to begin with , AND this beast is 35 years old with a few million miles and a whole lot of other issues to be pumping thousands and thousand of dollars into something that would sell for $15,000 if I was lucky. Since it was one of the Senator Leased Tour Buses, it is worth saving to be a curiosity, and I do use it for short runs with my band, but just doesn't make the least bit of sense to load immeasurable and unreasonable amounts of money into it. Don't get me wrong, I've now had 3 of the Eagles, and every one had it's own set of issues, and I love it....but sometimes even someone like me has to be sensible about this stuff. And that's kind of all it really is......stuff.
Next challenge is to deal with a failing FRONT torso, replace the front window,repair a few rusted frame sections, find and fix a plethora of engine leaks, replace hoses, figure out why the steering is wandering, check the steering column welds,fix the leaking air pump, take out the huge ONAN generator and haul it to a repair shop,new water system pump, fix the Sat system,re-index the left bogie,and get the old bugger painted.....but that's a subject for another very long post.
Take care Buddy, and Merry Christmas!!
jc
Jim Cummings
1983 Model 10
8V71
Auto Trans
Tour Bus Conversion Ex-Senator Coach
http://www.thejimcummingsband.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
jcb
 
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:37 am


Re: Model 10 Window
Tue Dec 17, 2019 9:20 pm


Jim, thanks for all the details, it looks like you have plenty of things to fix, about normal for old buses. If indeed the torsilastic was not providing any support, and was resting on the stop, and it sank back down after being adjusted, you had little to lose by welding (except starting a fire). The other styles of airbags I have seen in the center over the axle, may or may not be better than this arrangement, but in the case of the airbags in the Eagle manual, they were intended as a supplemental arrangement to provide extra leveling lift. I would still lean toward fashioning a rounded mount that bolts on. The quality of the welds in your setup will be crucial, I hope they hold on. I would eyeball them often until they develop a track record. Was it stick welding, or MIG?

As far as your steering wander goes, it could be misalignment, play in the steering box, loose tie rod ends, or worn king pins. Start with the cheapest first. The torsilastic adjustment in the front can affect the front geometry as well. My Model 05 was wearing the tires on the outside edge when I first got it, but after I adjusted all the torsilastics, that problem went away.

I need to replace (or bag) the driver side rear on my Senator 84. My intention is to take one off my parts Eagle and just whip it in. The problem is it's either too cold or too hot when I have time to do it. I need a bigger whip, I'm getting older and lazier. :o
Walter
Dayton, Ohio
1975 Silvereagle Model 05, 8V71, 4 speed Spicer
1982 Eagle Model 10, 6V92, 5 speed Spicer
1984 Eagle Model 10, 6V92 w/Jacobs, Allison HT740
1994 Eagle Model 15-45, Series 60 w/Jacobs, Allison HT741
User avatar
DoubleEagle
Club Member
Club Member
 
Posts: 152
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2018 9:26 pm
Location: Dayton, Ohio


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